The Blueprint for Better Living with Zeeshaan Shah

In the second episode of our Dubai Special, Adrian Strittmatter is joined by Zeeshaan Shah – entrepreneur, founder & chairman of The One Group – to explore how visionary leadership and a human-centred philosophy can unlock extraordinary real estate value.

From selling mobile phone contracts as a student to shaping $2.5B of projects worldwide, Zeeshaan shares how his guiding belief has never changed: real estate should improve people’s lives. That means creating destinations that feel like mini city-states – safe, social, lifestyle-focused places with community, convenience and genuine hospitality at their core.

In a world where expectations have shifted post-COVID, and where safety, tax certainty and lifestyle are driving global demand, Zeeshaan argues that the real opportunity lies in designing for how people want to live, not just what can be built.

Key talking points:

🏗️ Why the most powerful definition of value is simple: solve real problems

🌅 How tiny design decisions – orientation, views, access, flow – create compounding value

🛎️ Why luxury today is less about marble and gold, and more about hospitality-grade living

🔐 How political polarisation, safety and tax regimes are reshaping where people choose to live

👥 Why community and wellbeing are now the real drivers of demand

💡 How management after handover is where long-term value is either protected or lost

If you think real estate is about floor plans and finishes – or if you’re serious about building places that are healthier, happier and more valuable – this episode will make you rethink how value is created.

Zeeshaan’s LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/zeeshah 

One Group: https://oneg.com/ 

Adrian’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/adrianstrittmatter 

Saentys: https://saentys.com/ 

Transcript

Adrian Strittmatter: 0:52

Real estate today isn't just about square footage or square meters, transactions or yields. It's about creating destinations that inspire, empower, and deliver lasting value financially, socially, and culturally. How do you take that kind of vision and turn it into a business model that actually works? How do you combine real estate and venture capital to unlock new kinds of growth, scale, impact and value? In this episode of Bricks More Dubai Special, we explore how visionary leadership, disciplined systems, and a people first philosophy can transform how the world builds, invests and lives. As such, I'm absolutely thrilled to welcome Zeeshaan Shah, founder and chairman of the One Group, a global real estate and venture capital group shaping over$2.5 billion worth of projects worldwide. A multi-award winning entrepreneur, Zeeshaan has delivered over 3000 properties and built the One Group into a platform known for extra ordinary destinations that blend innovation, design, and more importantly, human connection. Beyond business, he is a Founder's Circle member of King Charles III, British Asian Trust, reflecting his absolute deep commitment to purpose, empowerment, and leaving a positive legacy. So let's dive straight in.

Zeeshan Shah: 2:19

Z, thanks ever so much for coming on the Bricks More Dubai special. And thank you so much for having me. It's really great opportunity to talk about your journey and the One Group that you founded. So you've really been active at a global level, now across sort of real estate and other sort of ventures. What was the start? How did what brought you here basically? Well, it's interesting. I was at university and whilst I was at university, I, took on a part-time job. And that was for this phenomenal company called Phones 4U. John Caudwell's company. We've worked for John. Yeah. Oh, have you? yeah. We worked. Oh, we've got something in common. Yeah, exactly. Ox, it's good kicking off. That's great. Small world. Small world. So, uh, and I got a job as a sales person there. Mm-hmm. I used to go to university in Nottingham. Mm-hmm. But I'm originally from Doncaster and I started a job in the summer and they gave me a job at Sheffield Meadow Hall, which like the marquee shopping center. Mm-hmm. Shopping mall of, of Sheffield or even Yorkshire basically. And this was their flagship store. So they had like something like 30 sales desks in there. Many people who don't know Phones 4U, they just, as you are, it was a phone shop. But this was a real hardcore, well oiled sales machine. Okay. And the first month I got there, I applied at the beginning of the summer. By the time I got the job and went through the training, they've got extensive two week training. Right. It was, I actually only had a month left before I had to go to university. So I, and I was, I needed money very quickly and, I, the day I got there, the first day I looked at the screen and they had this thing called the top earners bonus scheme. Mm-hmm. And there was top 10 people in the company who basically would get a bonus, out of like, you know, I dunno, 1500 salespeople. Okay. So I asked my manager, I said, what is that top earners bonus scheme? And he explained it to me, and they had that sort of a thousand pound bonus and you went down to 500 pound bonus. But I calculated that somebody who's in there is making round about six grand in a month mm-hmm. With their salary commissions plus this bonus on top. That's the bonus. And that's what I needed. Right. So I said to her manager, I was like, I need to get there in, I need to get in that top earners bonus scheme. She's like, sure, you work hard and over time you'll get in there. I was like, no. I need to get in there this month. Right. And he, he started laughing at me. Literally, he started laughing at me. He said, you can't do that. I said, why? He said, because you've got like all these people who've been working here for years, they start their month off with 50 renewals. Right. They've got 50 people's contracts coming back. Oh, okay. Because we're selling phone contracts basically. Right. That, so you've got your renewals and they're already got 50 renewals coming in and 60 and 70, they've got business accounts. No way. you haven't got a single client. Right. And it was my first sales job ever. I've never, ever worked a sales job right before that. I was like, okay. Anyways, I thought I, I'm gonna give it a shot. Right. that's what I need to get to. And in that first month, I ended the month as number four in the entire company. I hit that top earners bonus scheme in my first month, which, to the surprise of the, which had never, it had never been done before, never been done, never been done before. It was just like they, everyone thought it was absurd that one of the top salespeople in the entire company was in my, in my, branch. Mm-hmm. He got put to shame, like he was so far behind me that halfway through the month he just stopped. It was his worst month ever. And he had a nuance. He got so demotivated Yeah. By me coming in and doing this, that he actually just Oh, just gave up for the month. Oh, right. Yeah. it was quite weird. We were friendly though, me and that guy. So, but anyways, so within this, that one month was, it was such a huge learning experience for me that just, that one month, that was, that the first month that I was there and a couple of weeks in, it was one of my team leaders, so not the branch manager. Mm-hmm. but one of the managers below him, he said to me probably two or three weeks is, Z, you are too good for this. Right. I was like, okay. And that really sat with me. I was, I'm too good for this shit, That's not good. Like, I started this job and I'm doing well, and he's saying I'm too good for this. This gonna be a new problem. Like, what do I do anyway? What did you know? Yeah. I went off, I went back to uni, I got great recognition. They had this, a couple of weeks in, they had the annual award ceremony. Mm-hmm. And it's, it is the top a hundred or 50 performers that get invited there. They invited me there, the sales director for the whole group invited me onto stage and said, we've got this young star who's doing things that have never been done before, blah, blah, blah. Call me upon the stage. Mm-hmm. And, obviously for me, going back after that whole experience, I went back to university and then I went part-time with them. it gave me a lot of confidence. Yeah. And I was like, this is, so this is quite interesting. So what was your secret source then? What was the thing that you were,'cause if you look at that situation Yeah. And I think that's, as you're saying, gets student jobs always a great mm-hmm. Trade character. I worked at the check-in desk at Geneva Airport and that got me to teach, how people react under stress. Yeah. So what was your secret sauce? What was it that you were doing in, in, in terms of talking to people and convincing them and having that maybe human warmth or that ability to talk to them that was getting you there. I think number one is that I, I understood their sales process back to front. Mm-hmm. Right. the method of where what we were able to do was effectively buy people out of their contracts. So that's how we positioned it. Ah, okay. So let's say you've got six months left on your contract. I would have a budget of 150 pounds that I can pay back to you. Change to get you out your contract, but we wouldn't tell you that. What I'd say to you was that, look, if I could buy you out your contract and get you this brand new phone that you want, would you go for it? Would you change? Yeah. You'd be like, yeah, of course I would. You'd be like, boom, I'm doing it for you, right? Mm-hmm. I added my own strategies to it, but effectively I used to play that game so well that, that I'd mastered that game. Mm-hmm. So that wasn't one, I just understood their sales process. So what I always was great at is just common sense. Mm-hmm. Just common sense, just understanding, okay, what is my real USP that I've got here and how do I maximize that USP? That one thing. Second thing is building rapport. Mm-hmm. With people. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And rapport means, for me, it means trust and likability. Mm-hmm. Trust likability. Now, what does trust mean within trust? You also get respect as well. There's no point, and I, and I tell often when I don't lead sales teams anymore, but when I used to lead my sales teams, I used to tell them, don't get on the, don't speak to a client or meet a client and, just start talking about football and because you two both like the same club and you think, oh, he likes me now that, that's no good. Mm-hmm. He needs to first he to trust and respect you, then he needs to like you. Mm-hmm. And I just had a natural way of being able to organically of getting those two things right. If you've got, if somebody trusts you and respects you, but they don't like you, they most likely won't do business with you. Mm-hmm. If they like you, but they don't trust you, they won't do business with you. You need those two things from someone trust they respect you mm-hmm. And they like you. Right. So it's a bit of a balance there. Mm-hmm. Where they need to be. You hold yourself in a certain way that a person's like. Yeah. I trust this person. They're intelligent. This is somebody who I can learn from or somebody who I would do business with, somebody I would trust and I like this person, that they're not gonna do me wrong. The likability part actually just comes from, I'm just myself. I just be myself. Mm-hmm. I'm just, and some people will like it and some people won't like it, but that's something that I accept. If you are your, if you just be yourself, the people who like you will really like you for who you are and the people who don't like you, it's fine.'cause they don't like you who you are. They weren't gonna like you anyway. Right. Exactly. So there's no need to pretend. Yeah. So actually third factor was the, is the most critical. I would say, and that was, that we would work in, we would work four days on, three days off. Mm-hmm. And it'd be 12 hour shifts. Okay. With a one hour lunch break, because the mall will open from 10:00 AM to 10:00 PM So our shifts would be like, let's say Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday off, and you are working Friday. Mm-hmm. 10:00 AM 10:00 PM with your one hour lunch. I work seven days a week. Mm-hmm. on the three days I wouldn't get paid, but I'd just come to work to keep rack up my commission and keep my top owners bonus scheme, the retainers in. and my lunch would be, I'd go get a sandwich, eat it, I'd be back in 10 minutes back on my desk. So anytime that, we'd have team leaders at the front who had passes the clients, they just knew that Z sat at his desk. It doesn't matter what day it is, what's going on. So I think those three were the critical recipes. was the working hard, was that understanding their sales process and mastering it and having that rapport with clients, but coming back to, to, to the story so that I went back to university. And I didn't finish university, I left university. Mm-hmm. at the end of that year, which was my second year, and when I left, I was like, well, what do I do now? And I remembered what that manager said to me. This is too good for you. Yeah. This is too good for, I said, I know one thing that I'm too good for selling phones, and I know I'm good at selling. What is those expensive thing that I can sell? And no, we haven't. Property task, likability, drive. Yeah. Okay. we're there. We're there, yeah. Excellent. and this was 2006, seven. Mm-hmm. I think probably end of six or beginning of seven, something like that. Right. And, um, oh, okay. Dubai. Interesting time as well. Yeah. Dubai real estate market was booming. Mm-hmm. It was pre-financial crisis. Yeah. Okay. And, the first job I got was, with Damac. Okay. as a sales agent. Yeah. Right. I was a broker at Damac. and I worked with them for about, I think just about six months. Mm-hmm. And I used to get a very small salary and I'd get commission, and the commission, I would get, there were external brokers, just guys like me who were freelance. Mm-hmm. And they'd get paid about eight to 10 x the commission I would get. And just because I had this 600. So you had the fixed Yeah, because I had the salary. Yeah. But they were just lone ranger brokers. Mm-hmm. They'd work with all developers. So after about six months or so, I decided that, I'm just gonna go lone ranger. Mm-hmm. And that's effectively when my entrepreneurial journey started. Okay. And, yeah, that's me. That's real estate. And that's how it, that's how it began in, in Dubai. In this city. In the city in 2006, 2007. Yeah. yeah. Yeah. We started the agency in 2008 and that's I think a seminal moment for us as well of seeing the market, of thinking this is a really good idea, and then it going boom and then going like, is this a good idea? I'm not too sure, but as, yeah, as you said, it's a, it's, it is a market. I think when there are difficulties like that where you can reinvent the rules or see what was done, you know, maybe wrongly before, where, where would you say going? Just one last sort of more personal thing. Mm-hmm. Out of sheer curiosity and interest, where did you think the, or where do you think that drive came from? That seven day a week, early start, late finish? Where do you think, where do you think that came from? well, the thing is that my parents, they were both professionals. Mm-hmm. and they did relatively well, from where they came from in their respective careers. Mm-hmm. they did really well actually. but money was just always a problem. Mm-hmm. In our house. Right. It was just anytime the word, like if I went and I just needed five pounds for argument's sake. Oh my God. You'd get your ear chewed off. Do you know how hard it is? We work with this money. You have procurements, do you know this? And do you know that? Yeah. And it's just like, it's a half an hour of, for that and mm-hmm. And I just see their life. They'd wake up every morning, half five. Mm-hmm. Right. Running around, going to work, coming back at like 7:00 PM 8:00 PM Stressed out from my accord. we, but we went to private school. Mm-hmm. we had reasonably nice cars. We had a nice house. We weren't, I'm not gonna lie and say we were poor. We weren't poor, but we didn't have disposable money. Our parents did their best to like give us the best of all those things, but there's no free cash flow going around. But budget is late, but there's no additional right. There's no extras. And money was always an issue. So I just knew, and I was in a very, actually, I was in a very interesting circumstance mm-hmm. Because, going to private school, et cetera, and living in a good area and all those kind of things, I was at the bottom of the rich people. Do you know what I mean? Right. Yeah. See, just, just, just, just hanging at the cusp of like we can just, so it was an interesting place to be.'cause you see everyone and you're like, but you don't have it, but you're kind of there. So that gives you a lot of motivation and drive. Yeah. And one thing I just knew was looking at my parents was, and that's why I didn't finish university by the way I was, that I definitely don't want what they have. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. So I was like, that's why university didn't finish because I was, that was their plan. Go to university, get a good job, da da dah. I was like, employment? Employment. Yeah. No. Yeah. I know one thing for sure, and I don't want that. But the 5:00 AM starts stuck. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And so that, so 2007, 2006, you finish at Damac. Entrepreneurial flame is lit. What, how did sort of the One Group come about? how did you start setting it up? What was the construction? Construction process? Yeah, so actually, you could say it started at that point when I out on my own. Oh, true. But then Dubai Property Market crashed. Mm-hmm. then after that I went to Spain.'cause okay. Yeah. Now when I went to Spain because they were two, three years ahead of the curve. Their property market had crashed in like 2006, 5, 6. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And, somebody that had met over the years, being in Dubai over the year, two years that I was here at the time, was out there working with the banks and working on like, repossessed properties, right? Mm-hmm. Just selling them on. Yep. So, so I went to Spain and I was there for about, probably about just shy of a year, and I set up a company over there with him. Oh, okay. And we hired a sales team, et cetera. Mm-hmm. And we were basically selling those bank properties onto like, end users, end users and investors. So that, that is where you could say it. It started from, eventually I, then I left Spain then and I came back to Dubai. Mm-hmm. When would that be? Sort of 2009. Nine 10. Yeah. Nine 10. That period. I was about 24. Right. Came back to Dubai. and I had a bit of savings at that time. Mm-hmm. And I was just having a good time and, just enjoying it. Two, four. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And, just having a good time. And ultimately I, I spent all my savings mm-hmm. And I had nothing left. And I ended up going back to my parents' house when, probably about, yeah. 24, going on 25 probably. And, they live in Pakistan, in Karachi. Mm-hmm. So I ended up going back there and, I didn't have any money, so I was taking pocket money from my dad. Oof. Whilst I was working on, yeah. Whilst I was working, I'd become friends with, whilst I was here, I'd become friends with Floyd Mayweather. The Boxer. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Who was huge at that time. And. And we'd become friends over here in Dubai. And I was friends with Prince Nasim. Mm-hmm. And he introduced me to Floyd Mayweather. Floyd Mayweather. Okay. And I was working on. This boxing fight to the first ever mega boxing event in the Middle East. Ah, right. And Floyd introduced me to his like main promoter who was Al Hayman at the time. Mm-hmm. Who was running boxing. He was the biggest thing in boxing. And I was talking to him like twice a day and putting this whole thing together. And then I came back to Dubai to come and get funding from some sheikhs to put it together. Mm-hmm. It was probably 15 years ahead of its time, basically now looking at what's happening. Well now looking at what's ity and everything. Yeah, exactly. Coming a bit early with the idea. Right. But I had a whole business plan and everything. Yeah. Whilst all this is going on, I'm taking money from my pocket, money from my dad and he's like, what the f are you talking about? Who is Floyd Mayweather? You don't have a, you don't have a penny to your name. You're talking about doing a boxing fight and paying this guy go back to uni 20 million. Right. What are you doing? Like, what is, come on, where is absurd? Like, where's this going? It doesn't exist. Like you just, I think you're cooking up stories, right? I'm working on a boxing fight and I'm going to meet a sheikh. He's like, and you hear, you are, taking like. taking like 50 pound a week from me to get by, to tell me stories. To tell me stories. Yeah. we've all been there. Yeah. So what, anyways, what happens is that one day he came to me, and it was like a Friday evening I think, and, or a Saturday, one of the two, something like that. And anyways, he booked me a ticket, one way ticket to London. Oh. and he came to me and he says, here's a one way ticket to London, and I'm giving you 500 pounds in cash and forget that you've got a family. Forget that you've got home. You're not welcoming this house until you stand on your own two feet. Right. His fear was this kid's just gonna stick around here, keep doing this random, telling the stories. Yeah. Telling me like he's doing a, but I actually was doing it, but telling me all these stories and, he's not gonna make anything of his life, so, this is the hard way of doing it. I was like, oh, shit. So I went onto Gumtree. Oh, I can, I remember gum, God, Gumtree. I went on to gum. I've gotta find a place where I can go to tomorrow. Oh, I see that. Yeah. And I found this apartment, like studio apartment in Plaistow, in East London. Mm-hmm. I know it. Yeah. Right. And it was like 375 pounds for the month or something like that. And so I've emailed this guy, Chipon Chaudhary was his name. I've emailed this guy and said, look, I want to take your apartment. Mm-hmm. And he's agreed to it. And I've told him I'm landing at this time and I'll come straight to you. Right. And. I'm like, okay, well I've gotta break some news to him when I get there, which is that I've only got the month's rent. I haven't got a deposit to give him. Mm-hmm. Because literally all I had was that 500 pounds. 500 pounds. Right. But it's gumtree, so they're flexible. yeah. So he, I've got there and, met this guy, nice guy, and I said, look, here's a month's rent, but this is all I've got, but I promise you next month you will have your rent on time. He's like, no. And you paid up front, you gave him the, yeah, he gave him the month's rent upfront. Yeah. So I'm like, he's like, no problem. anyways, he, we walk into the, into a terraced house and we walked to the back of the house and like the back there was like, he'd made a studio apartment. Mm-hmm. In like, the garden. Okay. Right. I'm sure it was legal. I don't know, but it was, we're assuming it was in the garden. Right. And it was, the width of the place was like, if I spread my arms apart, I got a rock one way to there. I could touch both walls. Right. And, moved into there. And then I got a job, like a commission only job selling real estate. And about three or four months in, I got lucky, a friend of mine who I worked with in Spain, after Spain, I went to Dubai, he went to Portugal. Okay. Right. And he did some good deals over there. Well, good deals for us for that time. Mm-hmm. And he'd made some money and he came back to London and he'd even, he emailed me and said, Z I've just moving back to London. Where are you? Like, let's set something up. Mm-hmm. Right. and that is effectively, that is where One Group, like what we call today, One Group started from, okay. So I went to meet him. He said, look, you put the work in. But I think because of my, education and, that sort of upbringing, I was always very articulate. Mm-hmm. I could write well, I could represent myself well. I could hire people and that kind of thing. So people really like admired that skill. Yeah. So for someone like him who was a bit of a, deal maker, he was like, look, Z's like a little bit corporate, you know? Yeah. Corporate can do the front of house, like Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So he's like, I'm gonna put the money in. There wasn't much money to put in, but whatever, 50, 60 grand, it's gonna cost 70 grand at that time, which was a lot of money for me. and probably a reasonable amount for him as well. At that time. I'll put the money in, you do all the work and I'll give you 50%. Like, fair enough. Right. That's where it started from. So within a year I'd grown that business to, about 10, 15 people. Okay. Probably turning over a million or so pounds a year. And this is in London and you're still in London in the garden Shed in essence, or you've got, then you'd from there? No, I'd moved from there. From the garden shed. I moved, once I got going with him, within three months we were doing pretty well. You were doing the Okay. Yeah, and I moved to Brentford. Yeah, Brentford. Yeah. I moved to Brentford and our office was, at that time in Richmond. Oh, okay. Right. So Brent, for that drive over to Richmond, he was living in Richmond. I actually crashed at his plate, be I moved from Plaistow, crashed at his place for like a month or so. And then rented my, this place of my own. so anyway, so within a year or turning over in million or so pounds, got reasonable size team, 10, 12 people. He got busy with something else. And he was originally from Wales. Mm-hmm. Not Cardiff, somewhere else. And he went back there to do something. And I was affected just doing the entire business mm-hmm. At a z running it. and I think then at some point, I spoke to him probably about 18 months in from starting. I said, look, I'm doing all the work. I'm doing everything. Um, you know, dude, and you've made your initial investment back several times over. Can I just buy you out now? Mm-hmm. And he was like, yeah, sure. Right. was that fair enough? So that was an easy conversation. Then he was like, yeah, cool. Yeah. Yeah. It was, yeah. it worked reasonably well. Like I gave him a bit of money. Mm-hmm. and then it sort of a hundred percent became mine. and that was the brokerage and that, that, and that's where, that's, that was the starting of One Group. Then as things went on, in, I think by 2014 mm-hmm. We started underwriting, which means we were buying entire buildings and selling them on. So instead of just being a broker Okay. And making a commission, we were then going and saying, right, I'll buy all this from you. Negotiating a discount and selling it on still in London then. Yes. In London. Still in London, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Doing that. and we were, was really crossrail focused. Crossrail was the big thing back then. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And we found a pocket, which is the cheapest cross rail station. It probably still is Slough. Right. So we sort of homed in. Gotcha. Cross rail was booming. We homed in on this location as Slough and, bought a whole load of apartments and sold them, et cetera. Because some people were doing that with a Eurostar as well, weren't they? They were sort of dotting it. Oh, really? yeah. On the way to Paris kind of thing. Ashford and other places. Ashford International Ash. Yes. Ashford, international. International. I dunno why I use that. No one offend anyone. Ashford International. Yeah. Visited, I, I visited some real estate. There was a, the student housing development next to the station for sale. I visited that. Yeah. Seven, eight years ago. But anyway, so then we started investing. Mm-hmm. Um, and then 2000 and, uh, 17 started developing. But along the way, like for example, one Investments as a brokerage. Mm-hmm. They still do brokerage and that remains as an entity to the core. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's what it does. Mm-hmm. So then I made a new company that did developments. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So that's how the group became one investments, one home of the development arm, and then one capital was formed in the last seven, eight years. That's more so excess cash flows, profits, we use that to invest, to reinvest. Yeah. into different, that we've got 20 plus venture investments in different companies, just exciting different concepts. Yeah. And all sorts we, we invest into, and then some real estate stuff, but that's investing for rental income. Gotcha. To keep, keep like residual income opposed to like, developments to sell. That's, and when did you make the switch then? London. When did you take that? What it was return ticket to Dubai, if it were to come back here? No, we, I always stayed involved with Dubai. Okay. So even like when I was based in London, in, in 20 10, 11 onwards, still that period, we'd, no, we'd still do transactions over here. Right. Because I knew the market so well and I started from here. We'd always do transactions. No, I gotcha. Over here. and then 2016 when London slowed down, then we refocused on Dubai again. so we've always had a significant presence sort of significance from yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and how would you, if you were to describe an elevator pitch now, like very quick of the, like the One Group. what would you say it, it is in that sense, if you've got this conglomerate of different companies doing different things, but how would you pitch yourself as a, an elevator pitch as for the group? I think every company has its own pitch mm-hmm. Within the group. so I'd say, but if I was gonna say elevator a pitch for the group level, we're a diversified mm-hmm. Real estate focused development and investment firm. Yeah. Super clear. Yeah. Some people always struggle in doing that, so this is really clear. the podcast, really the way we wanted to develop it was to focus around a key, the key notion, which I think we're all involved in our different ways, we do obviously the brand and the marketing, and we're working on some great projects with you guys, is how do we unlock value? What is your, like, what would be your definition of

Adrian Strittmatter: 26:17

A value and how do you unlock it and how do you take a property from a and then bring it to Z and have that sort of, that unlocking mechanism. What would be your definition and how you unlock value in real estate? And is it still possible?'cause some people grumble that it's not. I think for me, my approach to business and is something that I teach my kids all the time now, as a core principle, business

Zeeshan Shah: 26:41

entrepreneurship is the process of solving problems.

Adrian Strittmatter: 26:45

Mm-hmm.

Zeeshan Shah: 26:47

And that is the ethos that I take into every business and every project that I do. So when I translate that into luxury residential real estate, which is the core of our portfolio right now, what that means is solving the problem is effectively improving standards of living. So that's where we start from. That's our base point. Mm-hmm. When I'm looking at a new opportunity, when I'm looking at a new piece of land or I'm looking at a building that we're gonna reposition, it's like, okay, how do I enhance people's lifestyles with this? Is it even possible in this location? Does

Adrian Strittmatter: 27:24

this,

Zeeshan Shah: 27:25

the magic formula of mine that I wanna create better lifestyles? Does it even work in this location? So sometimes you say no. yeah. A hundred percent.

Adrian Strittmatter: 27:32

or like, it's like, for example, the, our latest project, which is on Al Maja Island, we looked at several parcel of land in the end. The one that we chose was, it had parks on either side. It's on the beach front, and it's got parks on either side, which means we got open views for all of our units. We've got nothing that faces the back. Everything faces the sea and it's, the orientation is the sunsets in front of it. So it's those small details. Mm-hmm. That okay. We could have a plot on the other side of the island as well, potentially. I'm just saying. Or on the next island. Mm-hmm. But it's those small details that when we have that north star of improving lives that we want to create a better lifestyle. I'm like, okay, well when I sit on the beach, I don't want the sun setting behind me. I wanna see the sunset in front of me. Right. So it's those little small details that start from the very early stage of the process, the DNA of the project, is how we create value. And then when we appoint our designers, and we, because of, we spent so much time on our land acquisition, we've already got a bit of a story in mind of where this is going and how it came about, and what the key ingredients we've got to capitalize on are. Then when we're briefing our, when we're selecting the architects and the consultant, the design partners working with, we're already looking at, well, this is the direction we want to go in. Who are the best in the world that have done this before? Right? Mm-hmm. So going to another development of mine, it's called One Canal, which is just completing now. we chose an architect out of Miami called Kobe Kap, who's like this celebrity architect who's done like all the branded residences over there, et cetera, and we brought him in because of previous projects that he'd done so we could bring some of his magic magic onto the project, into our project. Exactly. Yeah. So for us, I think the way we look at, I look at real estate, we look at real estate as an organization, it's a little bit different and the very DNA, the beginning is how do we improve people's way of life? I think what's really interesting about that is that if you, and this is something that we've been banging on for a while, but I think the real thing is that then allows you to have an approach which is universal to real estate because it is all about how are people going to occupy the space and how are you going to make it better for them in terms of that human centric approach, we are seeing it being involved more and more now into other asset classes as well of saying, you know, our property brochures, even if it's for an office or a logistics center Are looking more and more like HR brochures. Yeah.'cause it's about the people and how they're going to occupy it. Do you think that's been enhanced in the last couple of years? Maybe post COVID and the way that, or the way that people are looking at themselves and how they occupy space? I think certainly, I think what's happened post COVID is that like when you look at the history, look, if you look at the last hundred years mm-hmm. We, we often forget, like, we're actually just, we're a culmination of everything that happened in, in from generations to us, what our parents experience, we've got parts of that within us and their part of what they are is what their parents experience. So just going, but for me, and probably for you as well, two generations ago, my grandparents were people who were coming out the war era mm-hmm. Of the world wars. Yeah. Completely. So at that point, survival was the number one thing. Yeah. Having a roof over your head was just paramount. Having food on the table was paramount. Then I think my parents were in that mid generation, right? Where they're like, okay, no, we have, we are not, we are not gonna get killed tomorrow morning. Right. Yeah. we will stay alive. Right. But still that survival of monetary survival mm-hmm. was just coming about and now we're a very comfortable generation. Right. And like, we've got everything. Everything is there. Life is comfortable. We don't have that, that survival problem of food on the table of water, of starvation, of wars in, well there is war. Immediate danger say. Yeah, exactly. So people's mindsets have shifted, but I think there hadn't fully shifted. But what happened when COVID happened was that people had a real shift in their mindset that we are, we're not in danger zone anymore. Mm-hmm. And I can actually enjoy my life because everyone was given this threat of, okay, we don't know, everyone might just die right now. We don't know what this virus is. It could just wipe half the world out. We've all seen the films. yeah. We've all seen the films and I think that had a real shift in people where they came out of that. Mindset of the last hundred years of like mm-hmm. Of being scared. And then to know, I just want to enjoy life and I wanna have the best of life. Yeah. That's why you saw like where in, in on this side of the world, you saw, nice climates in, in, in Europe and like Dubai for example boom. Versus, or even like the Spanish market coming back, Spain with a vengeance. Portugal, Spain, Greece, Portugal. Mm-hmm. Dubai. Yeah. Booming. Right. in America you saw Miami. Mm-hmm. Booming. you know, you can go Thailand, all the lifestyle centric destinations mm-hmm. Have gone up versus the practical locations gone down. London struggled more New York, Los Angeles, or LA's, a bit of a different story, but New York, London, the prime examples where that, the real gritty, practical city. Mm-hmm. If you, I don't want that anymore. Why do I wanna be in that? I, I want space. I want to enjoy my life. Mm-hmm. And I'm not in a danger that I have to, be in this rat race. Yeah. Let me step outside of it and enjoy life a little bit more. So I do think there's been a huge shift in mindset. And that momentum you talk about, and I know same thing for you where sort of active across loads of different markets and you can see, I dunno if it's like confidence, pizazz, whatever the word is Yeah. Is, is, is different. Is different in different locations. And then probably I think maybe culturally different as well. This current momentum that you're seeing in this regional market, how do you see it evolving? How do you see it potentially? I don't know, even talk about being sustained and what is fueling that momentum and that constant, what seems like a, an endless, endless momentum and an endless drive and dynamics in this market. There's so many things at play. you have to start then touching onto politics. Mm-hmm. And I think where we look at, Western countries now, there's so much political polarization. Mm-hmm. Yeah. yeah. Massively, huge amounts of political polarization. and then, affluent people don't feel safe anymore mm-hmm. In western cities. You've got on one side, you've got this, this right wing who is pro capitalism. Mm-hmm. and they're sort of very Right. They've become extremely right, let's say. Mm-hmm. And then you've got the, the left have become even more left, just polarization and they're sort of, sort of very like, pro socialism and, if you like take a city like London, for example, which was once a safe haven mm-hmm. For people from all over the world to come and spend and enjoy, people, they're not safe there anymore. But, and it's not the priority, the government's priority is not, saying that, okay, that guy who's worked hard and got a nice watch or got a nice car mm-hmm. I need to keep him safe and keep him here. Mm-hmm. Versus these smaller niche. You could say city states. Mm-hmm. Right. A catering to it. Yeah. They're saying, look, you've done well in life. You are affluent. I will protect you. I will serve you, I will give you a space to be. Mm-hmm. And I read an article about this maybe about 12 years ago, the rise of city states. Mm-hmm. That now no more the way the world's going. And I didn't even understand what they meant then. Right. But the way the world's going, right. Country, big countries are difficult to manage. Yeah. But city states make sense. Mm-hmm. So even if you were to take the UK for example, and this is really controversial, but if I was to take out London and make it into a country, yeah. Okay. Yeah. And London kept all its revenue. Right. Mm-hmm. London would be, it'd be, yeah, it'd be, Dubai times two. Right? I, you know what?'cause it makes a lot of money. It generates, yeah. Trillions of pounds and they invest it all back in London. Mm-hmm. Right. Versus the London that generates all that revenue but passes it onto the whole country, the keep the whole thing sustained. Right. So London as a, in its own entity, as a right, works as Dubai on its own works. But if Dubai was here and then next to Dubai, Dubai had another Dubai was 3% and it had 97% more To fund. To fund, yeah. Then Dubai wouldn't work either. Do you know what I'm actually super, super happy you've talked about this, but because I have been boring the pants off of people with this is a city state thing. Started with London and Hong Kong, just the realization and then definitely Dubai and I was there like, okay, like started like scrambling around and Florence and Venice. In Italy used to be those city states, and they're like, okay, there's a historic precedent. So thanks alluding to it because I am, I'm definitely on the same page with that. and I think it's that ability to manage a defined sort of Yeah, with defined metrics as well. I think there's a lot in that, in that thought process of why that works really well. So in terms of that momentum, you've touched upon a few factors. What else is you're talking about that security potentially also that political stability. feeling safe is obviously, physically safe, but also safe from a financial perspective, with regards to very changing tax regimes. There you go. What else do you feel is also that's underpinning that sort of, that desirability of the market here? If I would say, I think the top three factors mm-hmm. Right? is tax. Yeah. It's that physical safety. Yeah. Right. right now my, my, family still live in London. My kids live in London, because they go to school there. Mm-hmm. And they go to a phenomenal school and I don't wanna disturb them at this stage, but they, my oldest is nine. Right. So they go, they're very much in our cocoon. They, they go to, they go in the car to school, they come back, they'll be dropping to play dates, blah, blah, blah. If my son is 15 and he's, now I want to go out with my friends and we're going out tonight and we're going on the tube. But I might actually decide now, you know what? I'd rather you be here.'cause no lifestyle choice in the world, no school in the world, no money in the world is pa more important to me than my child's safety. Mm-hmm. So I'm thinking about it with people chil with parents who've got kids who are 15 and 16 and 17, and they have got that ability to move around the world. Mm-hmm. I'd probably leave London. Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to be a parent that, gets some terrible news one day and you hear it every other day. Mm-hmm. my, my son, his school's, he goes to St. Paul's, which is, in Barnes. Mm-hmm. And they walk over the bridge and it's just over the bridge from Hammersmith. And it was around about not somebody from their school, but there's only a couple of months ago there was another kid from a different school in the local area, and he got stabbed outside the tube station. There's loads of the St. Paul's kids going to the tube station. So I'm like, you don't want to be that news article when it comes to that. It's super close. Is there anything that, is there anything that's more important? Does it matter to all, but I love the restaurant down the road, and we've been going to that Italian ever. No, you're like, my child's safety. Mm-hmm. We'll go to Timbuktu. we'll live in the jungle, but I'm, if Mm-hmm. So that is so important. And then the tax regimes just ridiculous now. Mm-hmm. it's really, it's like when you start calculating. What you are making and what you're paying for that, it's like, okay. and after you've paid everything, you probably ended up with, I did a calculation. I think you end up with, when you're on the higher tax rate, you probably end up with about 38, 30 9% in your pocket after you've done your vats and your, you've done all and your road tax and all the rest of it. Right. All the additional taxes that you don't actually calculate in your income tax. Mm-hmm. After all of that, you wanna hand it over to your kids and you're gonna pay them ano another 50%. Again, they have to pay. Yeah. There are things that don't Yeah. Mathematically. Mathematically. That's a really, 10% is mine and 90 yours, a quick handwritten spreadsheet. And they're like, yeah, that's, it is tougher, you know? Yeah. In terms of, so you talked about something before, which is really interesting about creating these ecosystems around real estate projects and you've got this market in which you play and that allows you to change these buildings into destinations. And you alluded to it with the architect in Miami. How do you, how do you select the team? It is just something you've just reminded me of something which I'll tell you before I tell you about the mm-hmm. Ing part's Good. Which is that what we do is, that same way that the city state theory mm-hmm. That city states are working. What is that? It's a microenvironment. What we do as well is within our development, we tr try to create a very, a mini, mini, mini city state where it's a microenvironment. Okay. Catering to a certain type of person. That's a nice approach. Yeah. Yeah. So that's, it is the same ethos that we roll with that we want to create that sort of real bubble that you want to be in. Mm-hmm. and your question was about how we select the designers, though? the whole, the full ecosystem, so I think, yeah, exactly. So if you were to take, okay, it's a mini government or a mini state. You've got your different departments. Mm-hmm. How do you select your ministers? It depends. it depends. It really depends on the project at hand. The, it is like when we are, when we're looking at a project, it's, that raw material that we have, what, where, what direction we want to take in is beach front. It's, on an island like the one we're doing now, for example. then I want to go to the experts who've delivered in that space. Mm-hmm. It's branded. Okay. I want to go to the experts in that space. I will then study their projects. I'd look at, I'll look at what they've done in the past and be like, yeah, the, these guys have done mm-hmm. What I'm looking for. So there's a quote that I always use and sometimes I even put it in our brochures. Sir Isaac Newton, which is, if I've seen further, it's been by standing on the shoulder of giants. Mm-hmm. And it's just about putting that dream team together of, yeah, I've got a grand idea, but I don't know how to, build the foundations of that grandad. That's where you're bringing in the right people. That's why, for example, we work with you guys on, on comms and communications mm-hmm. And branding, because you are the experts in putting that vision out there. I could have it in my mind. Yeah. But you know, you've gotta have the right people who can put that together for you. So it's just about selecting who's done it in the past, then giving them the right brief, giving them the right enthusiasm, and staying involved in the process. your team will tell you I've probably been in 80% of the calls. They were alluding to it and it was an extremely positive, I think, involvement, which isn't always the case, but kudos u they were extremely positive. You're extremely passionate and want to see the idea through, from start to finish, and I think that's been, extremely well received. So thanks for being so definitely thanks from the team. They're not here, but I'm turning around. Thanks for the team, for, staying involved and that's been a really great process. And just one thing then, you we're talking about the long term. So you've got the team, you develop the property, you sell or lease the units and the property becomes an active destination with people. How do you continue, or how do you make sure that you then in essence become a steward to those, and they will revert back to your brand? How do you, and going back to this is really nice'cause loads of things are linking up that involvement of yours. How do you stay involved post. Development, post delivery, post sales or rental, it's an active destination. That is a great question. and it is such an important one. Mm-hmm. Because

Zeeshan Shah: 43:38

you can build as brilliant of a space as you want, but if you don't manage it correctly, post handover, post people moving in within a couple of years, it's worthless. Mm-hmm. Completely. You, you might as well have not built it. You might as well have just built what the next door neighbor was building, what any normal developer was building, because that's the, that mm-hmm. That becomes a utilization. you've built a beautiful gym that is, got views of the city, for example, or views of the beach, and you put the best equipment in there. If you don't manage it correctly, after a year and a half, it's gonna be empty. Yeah. So you've just wasted a load of money and time putting a gym in prime real estate space where you could have actually just sold some apartments. Right? Yeah. because it is, it's not of, it's not of utility. Mm-hmm. So that is actually a key thing in the, first of all, in the design process, it design the scheme in a way that flows, that people are going to use it.

Adrian Strittmatter: 44:31

Mm-hmm. So understanding how people will interact with your space, with the space. Yeah. when they're walking in, right. Where is the, where, how are they going to be traveling through the building? Mm-hmm. You want them to experience different things and convenience to be there as human beings we're really lazy if you add No, really we are. if you put a gym like that is a three minute walk from somebody's apartment, the likelihood of them going reduces by like 60%. So every minute you add is basically, yeah. Yeah. It's crazy. So people want a flow of convenience where they feel like I take three steps and I get there and I take three steps, and I get, it's not physically possible, flow, convenience, but you can make it in a way that you feel, the things feel like they're all interconnected and you get around seamlessly. Mm-hmm. So that element is very critical. First of all. But then it's about like, again, I'm coming back to one of our projects, which is completing now, and we've hired a GM from a hospitality background. Yeah. From a hotel. It's not a branded residence, it's a hotel. Then the no, our, that development's not branded. It's our own, but the hospitality, yeah. It's from But the guy who's coming from a hotel. Exactly. So that is the thinking that, look, we want hospitality grade services. Mm-hmm. Right? It doesn't matter that we're not renting the rooms out on a daily basis, but we want this managed as a hotel will be managed, and that is what people expect today from luxury living.

Zeeshan Shah: 46:01

Luxury is no longer about, I want marble on my wall and marble on the floors, and I want gold taps. No, luxury is a way of living.

Adrian Strittmatter: 46:10

It's it that's like the latest brand that we've launched is called Elevate, and that's what it's all about. Elevate is when you talk about something and you describe it as elevated mm-hmm. That's el that restaurant is elevated. That, that, that, that way of looking that's elevated. Mm-hmm. That person looked elevated. Mm-hmm. Or that destination's elevated.

Zeeshan Shah: 46:31

It's subtle luxury. It's luxury that is less on show.

Adrian Strittmatter: 46:35

Mm-hmm.

Zeeshan Shah: 46:36

And more on depth.

Adrian Strittmatter: 46:37

Yep.

Zeeshan Shah: 46:37

Right.

Adrian Strittmatter: 46:38

That, that,

Zeeshan Shah: 46:39

so for us, that is what we try and do now.

Adrian Strittmatter: 46:42

And if you were to maybe on a sort of talk about sort of one specific development or case study that you would say is like one of the, the crowns in the jewel, which one, could you talk us through like a specific development that you've from start to finish and how that journey evolved and developed and where it is today? well, my, my first, well we. The, like the real this end of the luxury. Mm-hmm. The first building's completing now, because for me, I wasn't there 6, 7, 8 years ago. I wasn't there myself. Yeah. To have this vision and idea, this is the last sort of five years and buildings that I've launched since then. They're the ones that have come into this sort of space. The more, the more space that you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. So before we, we have buildings which stand out. Mm-hmm. And they're nicer and we did them better. And we, they're, but they're not, this is really now where the first completions this year. And how are you feeling about that? Super confident. In terms Excited. Yeah. Oh, for sure. And see it's not difficult, right? It's not like, it's not difficult. It's, people just don't have the most developers, they don't have the intention. Of doing it. They look at a project and they say, this is my land cost, this is my construction cost, this is my soft costs, and this is my profit. And they're closing the box the day of the profit. Not everybody, but I'm talking about majority. Yeah. The clo, the day they hand over their project is the day they're done. Right. They're like, mm-hmm I've done my job. Now there's no more money in it for me anymore because post handover, there isn't any money in it for me anymore in that building. But that's not the way I look at it.'cause that is my brand. Yeah. That is what is gonna, that's where the value's gonna be. My next project to next project. That is where I'm gonna incrementally get more and more value because of how these run. Mm-hmm. So it's not difficult for someone to go out and say, okay, I'm gonna spend some time and interview GMs from hotels and then I'm gonna handpick the right one and I'm gonna communicate my vision to him. I'm gonna say, this is what I want you to do, and then I'm gonna get him to. Create SOPs on how to operate this building. Mm-hmm. I'm gonna get'em to put together a five star team. That money's not going from my pocket. It's the residents living in there, they're paying a service charge. Anyway, there's just that little bit of extra time and attention that I'm putting into to curate that whole system. There is the difference. Well, I think Exactly. And I think, as you, you know, alluding to, people can have multiple homes, multiple destinations or sometimes in the same destinations or they'll have kids. So if you've got that trust, that long-term vision, you would hope that they would between brackets, stay in the one family and say, well, son, daughter, would like to, buy something for them. Well, let's definitely go there.'cause he's had such a great experience over time. yeah. No, absolutely. that's exactly what we aim for. And in terms of sort of closing off, what would you say, you kind of alluded to it, where would you see. One of the big, or like one of the major still untapped or looking at opportunities or value generation that you can see in real estate. What are the things that you guys are working on that, you could say, okay, this is, we've got still constant room for improvement in terms of, what we're delivering and what we're unlocking. What would you say those are? it's really what people's expectations are today from, multi-family like apartment buildings Okay. is a lot different to what it was even five years ago. Okay. People want that to be the cornerstone of their lifestyle and that's what we understand and that's what we're creating. It's not just, there's a lobby and lobby's got, lobby looks nice and there's a concierge to receive your post and you go up to your room and that's it. Now we are, we're building communities. People today want community, they want to be with like-minded people. Mm-hmm. Health is important, wellness is important, lifestyle is important. And we're building all of that into our developments, and that's where we see where the opportunity is. That's not being done very well on scale. as in you've got pockets of good developers doing good work, no doubt, but it's not being done well across the board. And I think that is where, we will, our real focus is, and where we will really distinguish ourselves in creating developments that are cornerstone of your lifestyle, that, that improve your way of living. So what I really like about that idea is it's going back to fundamentals, but expressing them in a modern way. Mm-hmm. And I think that purpose and that sort of human-centric. Element that you talk about and have talked about through throughout the podcast is really nice'cause it is fundamental universal values that we all share, whichever way we choose to express them. So I think, yeah, I think it's an extremely exciting vision. What we've, just to some of that part, what we've focus on is,

Zeeshan Shah: 51:52

we look at the world's blue zones

Adrian Strittmatter: 51:55

mm-hmm.

Zeeshan Shah: 51:55

Where people live the longest and healthiest lives, and what are the core elements over there that we can bring in to our developments.

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:05

Number one is community. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Zeeshan Shah: 52:09

People are happier and live longer lives the more friends they have and the more interdependency they have in a community setting. If you want to be happier, spend more time with your friends.

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:20

Mm-hmm.

Zeeshan Shah: 52:21

The depth of your relationships and the number of your relationships correlates directly to your happiness. And it's crazy as a real estate developer be talking about this, but this is where our thinking comes from, that is what great real estate can do. And that is what raising standards of living is about.

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:36

Mm-hmm. Is when you do it right. These are thi these are the things that you can do. Those are the beautiful collateral Yeah. Results that you are getting. Yeah, exactly.

Zeeshan Shah: 52:44

And then community.

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:46

Yeah.

Zeeshan Shah: 52:46

And health.

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:47

Mm-hmm. Is about movement. So

Zeeshan Shah: 52:49

building

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:50

in

Zeeshan Shah: 52:50

that into your day-to-day lifestyle,

Adrian Strittmatter: 52:52

having community events, talking about, for example, in the Mondrian on that we're doing in Marja on the rooftop. We've got a, we've got a, Mondrian Sky Lounge, clubhouse, it's got coworking spaces in there. It's got a bar in there. It's got like dining rooms in there and lounge people can congregate, come together. We've got a recovery zone, where you can do your sauna and ice bath and all those great things. We've got adults pool, we've got barbecue areas. We've got a 10,000 square foot indoor outdoor gymnasium that faces the beach. We've got yoga and Pilates now. Okay. They're all the hard infrastructure. But

Zeeshan Shah: 53:29

when you package that up with the management and the service and everything,

Adrian Strittmatter: 53:34

yeah.

Zeeshan Shah: 53:34

When you bring that all together, that's where we bring those blue zone. Sort of key characteristics into the way of life, and that's what people are looking for,

Adrian Strittmatter: 53:44

people are looking for.

Zeeshan Shah: 53:46

The focus is healthier, happier, and that's what we're going to deliver.

Adrian Strittmatter: 53:52

I think you've solved unlocking real estate value for us today. Z thanks ever so much for being on the podcast. It's been an absolute blast. I really enjoyed it. Thank you, Z. Thank you.